March 13th 2017

When I established the forums in 2005 it was to offer a more richer web experience and greater functionality than the platform where we started this social adventure in 2003, Yahoo Groups. The forums were once a busy hive of activity and provided locals and visitors with a wealth of information just like the Geocaching Ireland Discussion Group on Facebook today.

It was a time where we didn't have the many social media platforms we have today, and it was a different time in terms of mobility and technology. There was no instant access to information, no Google Maps and a very limited base map on your GPSr. Mobile connectivity for me was a 9600bps Infrared connection from a Nokia to a laptop and in later times to a PDA using WAP.

As we moved into the social media era so did our forums users. Geocaching Ireland moved there too, and we have a thriving community on the Geocaching Ireland Discussion Group on Facebook. As a result, forum activity isn't what it used to be and I have taken the decision to disable new registrations to the forums and to make the forums read only so any information there can still be accessed.

The discussion hasn't ended, it has just moved. Join us on the Facebook Geocaching Ireland Discussion Group .

Donnacha

Reverting to basic membership

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johnrm

Reverting to basic membership

Post by johnrm » Mon Nov 07, 2011 5:07 pm

Today I received and (automated) email from GS saying that My membership would revert to Basic membership if I didn't cough up within 7 days. (not quite like that, but you know what I mean.)
I logged in and my account is already at basic membership! No 7 day wean-off!

Ericles

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by Ericles » Mon Nov 07, 2011 5:12 pm

Sloppy. Did you actually get the time you paid for (quarterly or annually)?
It's one thing if their email is misleading but I'd be pretty #$%&*d if they shorted me a week.

johnrm

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by johnrm » Mon Nov 07, 2011 5:32 pm

I got the 7-day notice today and theres no 7 day notice period.
I'm not doing as much GC'ing as before, so I might take a back seat and give it to the government at budget time. :(

barraseaclaid

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by barraseaclaid » Mon Nov 07, 2011 11:10 pm

I did something similar with travel insurance john they were gonna auto renew in august and I told them to take a hike as I wouldnt be going anywhere till at least jan and would renew then....if you need a pq run some random day drop me an email

johnrm

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by johnrm » Tue Nov 08, 2011 9:57 am

Thanks for the offer Bar,
As GS have violated their own terms, I won't feel guilty violating theirs.
Nothing like a little violence!

(I have emailed them, awaiting a response)

Ericles

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by Ericles » Tue Nov 08, 2011 7:32 pm

Let us know how it turns out.

Is sharing cache info really against "The Terms"? I bet that wouldn't stand up to any legal challenges.

johnrm

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by johnrm » Tue Nov 08, 2011 8:42 pm

Ericles wrote:Is sharing cache info really against "The Terms"?
Yes according to their Ts & Cs, but equally whats against the terms (IMO) is cutting someone off when you say they have 1 week to pay up.

barraseaclaid

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by barraseaclaid » Tue Nov 08, 2011 10:45 pm

john just outa curiosity now this is what I found:

Groundspeak hereby grants You a non-exclusive, non-transferable, revocable license to view and use the Site in accordance with this Agreement and any guidelines or policies posted on the Site. Groundspeak reserves the right to suspend or revoke, in its sole discretion, the license hereunder and to prevent You from accessing all or any portion of the Site with or without notice or reason and without liability on the part of Groundspeak.

Is there other guidelines that state that pq's and other pm features can only specifically be used by a PM. Im aware of at least two instances where caching families use one prem. account to generate pqs while all the rest are basic members only but all use one copy of gsak..although I note that many of our own here (freakycat/medic, Bluejay/toffeeman) have seperate prem. accounts...

from the above guideline I guess the part sharing such pq's lies in the "non-transferable" part but it does not say anything specific regarding file distrubution as in essence thats what a pq is?

Maybe graham would give us his two cents on this if he has the answer?

medic143

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by medic143 » Wed Nov 09, 2011 4:57 am

Freakycat only has a temporary Premium account so that we could sort our a few double logging issues and it made it a little easier to download in bulk caches she hadn't done that I had. For most of the time we've been caching we've worked off the 1 premium account. In fact when the current 3 months expires we'll be back to doing that.

johnrm

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by johnrm » Wed Nov 09, 2011 9:18 am

I received a reply from GS saying that the message should have gone out a week earlier.
They are putting it down to a glitch, and are running it through their bug-fix procedures.

One reason why you would not want to dish out your own PQs is that if you have a multi with a hidden final, the final coords are a POI in the resulting GPX file.

Ericles

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by Ericles » Wed Nov 09, 2011 3:49 pm

johnrm wrote:One reason why you would not want to dish out your own PQs is that if you have a multi with a hidden final, the final coords are a POI in the resulting GPX file.
If you load that PQ into GSAK it will have the finds for the other person too. I made that mistake once and had to manually fix the "found" caches.

I really don't see anything about sharing cache information. Heck, I have a few of my PQs emailed to a third party directly so I have access via smartphone. Unless we hear otherwise, I don't see a problem with emailing each other PQs. 8)

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MunsterFan
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Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by MunsterFan » Wed Nov 09, 2011 4:13 pm

Right... (takes out stub of a pencil and a dog-eared notebook) could ye all form a queue and be ready with yer names....
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dino
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Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by dino » Wed Nov 09, 2011 5:57 pm

It's *definitely* against the T&Cs of the site and some people have been banned for facilitating it via websites.

Personally the cost of PM is so small and the benefits so good I don't really see an issue.
Some gal would giggle and I'd get red
And some guy'd laugh and I'd bust his head,
I tell ya, life ain't easy for a boy named "Sue."

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Ericles

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by Ericles » Wed Nov 09, 2011 7:42 pm

From the Groundspeak Terms of Use (as of 2 August 2011):
Section 3 All materials available on or through the Site, other than Third Party Submissions (collectively, the "Site Materials") are the property of Groundspeak or of its licensors and are protected by copyright, trademark, and other intellectual property laws. You may not reproduce or retransmit the Site Materials, in whole or in part, in any manner, without the prior written consent of the owner of such materials, except as follows: You may make a single copy of the Site Materials solely for Your personal, noncommercial use, but such copying must be consistent with any applicable additional terms and conditions and You must preserve any copyright, trademark, or other notices contained in or associated with such Site Materials. You may not distribute such copies to others, whether or not in electronic form and whether or not for a charge or other consideration, without prior written consent of the owner of such materials.
So, for instance, if the coordinates and cache description fits into the above you may not distribute them. But wait!
Section 6 All comments, articles, tutorials, screenshots, pictures, graphics, tools, downloads, and all other materials submitted to Groundspeak in connection with the Site or available through the Site (collectively, "Submissions") remain the property and copyright of the original author.

As with any legalese, this is open to interpretation but if we're the authors of cache pages (as Submissions) then it's not "Site Material" and not bound by section 3. Of course it goes on to say that any Submission is subject to any use by Groundspeak so while you may be the author you've given them all usage rights.

The issue for sharing PQs is that they are likely bound as Site Material because it's a custom GPX format created and packaged by The Site and therefore is now subject to Section 3 again. I'm thinking an export from GSAK is safe but you may be banned "without reason" as per the opening to section 3:
Groundspeak reserves the right to suspend or revoke, in its sole discretion, the license hereunder and to prevent You from accessing all or any portion of the Site with or without notice or reason and without liability on the part of Groundspeak.
In other words... don't give them an excuse. [-X

barraseaclaid

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by barraseaclaid » Wed Nov 09, 2011 11:44 pm

not that I was explicitly going to but I prob wont now...thanks niall and eric for the input but again harking back to say medics situation is that a bit of a grey area or is would that be considered for sole use as a couple...for example one service I use allows download of materials for your sole use but to up to 4 pcs/terminals but seeing as 3 of these i own are used by myself and my significant other it is technically a violation of the terms but having contacted the provider they have no issue with this ( its a piece of research software that cost me the guts of 1000euro just for the record so was def. not gonna shell out for two copies )

medic143

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by medic143 » Thu Nov 10, 2011 7:01 am

Specific to my own circumstance if Groundspeak were to make an issue of me "providing" coordinates for premium caches for wife when effectively she only caches with me I'd walk away from caching in the morning.

That said I agree with Dino that if you cache as a hobby €23 pa is a small price to pay for the additional facilities attached to the membership.

I think however Groundspeak should look at a family plan (I know it would be open to abuses) where children of premium members could get a discounted rate until they reached 18. This is basic business - catch them when they're young and keep them forever.

fitzet
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Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by fitzet » Thu Nov 10, 2011 1:42 pm

I thought that you had to be a premium member to log finds against premium caches ?

medic143

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by medic143 » Thu Nov 10, 2011 6:20 pm

fitzet wrote:I thought that you had to be a premium member to log finds against premium caches ?
No. There are two ways I know how to do it.

(1) Track files. These are txt files created by some units (Oregons do it amongst others). They provide a time/date stamp and any text you entered in the field. Fantastic way of logging power trails. The main drawback is you have to have the GPX file loaded in the unit to create the track log and for that you need the premium membership or a generous benefactor. Were you caching with a premium member you could (I suppose) create a text file in the right format to log any premiums you did since the GC code is public knowledge,

(2) geocachingadmin.com. Again you need to have been given the coors or riden on the coat tails of a premium member to find the cache but once you have found it use this site to enter the GC code and choose the log option. Until I got into track logs this was the method I used for Lisa.

johnrm

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by johnrm » Tue Nov 15, 2011 4:18 pm

I just had a look to see what Irelands Top Ten.
Sorting the list is not allowed on Basic membership.
Maybe I need to find a new hobby.
:roll:

barraseaclaid

Re: Reverting to basic membership

Post by barraseaclaid » Tue Nov 15, 2011 11:25 pm

here are the current top 11

Image

now in fairness 30squid a year is fair enough...your tv liscence alone costs 5times that...or even 15 cups of coffee at your fave petrol station...

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